More evidence of diet and MS

This is an research paper just published that shows that Statins (drugs which reduce cholesterol) reduced brain atrophy in people with Progressive MS.

A diet (not just a good diet) such as OMS which cuts out all meat and dairy will significantly lower your cholesterol rock bottom without having to take large amounts of more drugs.

http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingC.../ECTRIMS/35241

[SNOOPY]

BigA,

The article you have run across is not new news and the thought of statins improving MS has changed. I would suggest anyone who is on or goes on a statin to use extreme caution.

In my opinion Statins should not be used with MS patients. There are some serious side effects which can worsen some of the symptoms seen in MS -- fatigue, weakness, memory loss/cognitive problems.

There is documentation of this (I am one of them) and why the FDA put out more warnings on Statins.

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsro.../ucm293623.htm

Statins can be dangerous to patients even those without MS. When you have MS it becomes difficult to know if you are progressing or if it is the Statin...until you go off the Statin and see how you feel.

[techie]

I love my milk

I could live without meat but milk! Ain't going to happen. Even the occasional chocolate milk shake. I can live with just having an occasional shake.
But never again?
Never happen
techie

[JerryD]

I appreciate your attention to this and other diet topics. You always get my attention because you realize that pharmaceuticals are NOT the ONLY way to beat this MonSter. And you clearly articulate the facts supporting that viewpoint. That point of view runs counter to that which is common and overwhelming. For that, alone, I thank you. Good luck

[BigA]

Jerry: Thanks. I appreciate it. For the record, I do diet, exercise, meditation and Avonex.

Snoopy: I put this in the diet section because I am not advocating statins. But it does help prove diet, espeically Swank type diets (IMO). My cholesterol is below rock bottom since giving up meat and dairy.

Techie: It's up to you, but obviously you're thinking about it or you woudln't have read or commented. All I can say is that milk is the one thing that's most easily replaced and your tastes change.

And for all those who think they'd suffer on a diet: Try it for 6 months and see how you feel.

[Redwings]

Hi BigA:
The study about statins from ECTRIMS has nothing whatsoever to do with diet and isn't proof of anything regarding diet and MS.

What in the article gave you the idea that the benefit statins may offer people with MS (at least in this study) is from the lowering of cholesterol, and what supports your position that diet, therefore, has the same effect? How does the study prove that connection?

From your post, you're asserting that statins and diet are equivalent in their beneficial effect on MS, and by the same mechanism. How, then, do you explain the studies in which statins had no effect on MS? Because your position makes statins and diet equivalent, those studies are then clinical proof that diet has no effect on MS. Based on those studies (which also had absolutely nothing to do with diet), your thread title would have to be "More evidence that diet has no effect on MS."

Where is the evidence you're basing your premise on?

[ewizabeth]

I take a low dose statin and I also watch my diet carefully and I'm doing fine. If your doctor watches your symptoms carefully then you should be fine with statins. I have elevated cholesterol so that's why I'm taking statins but I also have MS.

[JerryD]

Redwings,
I know I shouldn't debate you and your rationale because none of this medical stuff is my forte. 'Fools jump in...'. But I am sure there is a connection between diet and the use of statin drugs. How that connects to MS, I don't know. But let's consider this.
Statin drugs are designed to lower cholesterol, which, I think, is produced by the liver. It is generally believed that diet can produce the same cholesterol lowering outcomes, given strict adherence. Why do you think all of the Swank type dietary guidelines have been so strict on the fats and oils intake, etc ?
That's the connection between statins and diet and MS. I know it seems like a huge jump. But Swank, MacDougall, Campbell and Esselstyn, etal, have produced amazing results that have not been matched by traditional 'pharmacologic' based medicine. And as long as there is no FDA approved 'cure', I ,for one, have no reason to seek treatment with drugs.
The medical profession always touts the benefits of 'diet and exercise'. That's words only. But the clinicians grab for their prescription pads, first. Who's kidding who ? How many people with high cholesterol do you know have been prescribed a 'diet and exercise regimen? Rarely happens ! Drugs first, then a conversation about diet. That's a a joke !

[Special Kay]

Agree with Redwings. Saying statins may help MS is not the same thing as saying low cholesterol may help MS. It's important to read studies carefully for what they actually assert and not extrapolate. There's enough misleading reports about health out there as it is!

Which is not to say low cholesterol isn't a good goal. Mine is below 150 and I'm pretty happy about that.

[SNOOPY]

There seems to be a misconception about cholesterol and diet.

It is true diet and exercise can help reduce cholesterol. Unfortunately, genetics plays a role in this. A person can be thin, eat a healthy diet, exercise and still have high cholesterol.

In my case, my high cholesterol as well as depression was caused by a prescribed medication.

Instead of taking me off of the non-necessary med I was put on a Statin. I was taking a very low dose (20mg).

In the year and a half I was on the Statin I lost my quality of life.

I could no longer drive, I got lost in familar surroundings, could not remember where I was going, I could not carry on a conversation as I would forget what I was going to say next. I became unable to exercise, exercise increased my fatigue. My legs became extremely weak yet they where very stiff.

My neuro ordered a NeuroPsych evaluation/testing as Alzheimers(sp) was under consideration. My symptoms started improving within 2 weeks of stopping the Statin. The NeuroPsych said his profession was seeing more and more cases like mine that was due to Statins.

I went off the Statin over a year ago and I have not taken anything for high cholesterol, I don't need to, it's normal.

[JerryD]

So maybe the statin drug had a nasty side effect. And to stop the side effect, you stopped the drug. What would have happened if you religiously followed the Swank diet ? One will never know because nutrition can't be prescribed on a prescription pad.
I don't know about the Swank diet and its effect on his patients because I don't believe it is documented but it would be interesting to see the effects of a low fat, high plant based diet studied at the FDA level.

[BigA]

Agree with Redwings. Saying statins may help MS is not the same thing as saying low cholesterol may help MS. It's important to read studies carefully for what they actually assert and not extrapolate. There's enough misleading reports about health out there as it is!

Which is not to say low cholesterol isn't a good goal. Mine is below 150 and I'm pretty happy about that.

Which is also not to say that low cholesterol isn't good for MS either.

But you guys are right that I overstepped the association. Jumping from a statin to diet.

Redwings You're right that my selecting positive studies to draw a conclusion and not doing so for negative studies is inconsistent and perhaps overzelous... But I think it's a little dramatic to suggest I should do the same when a negative study comes out when conflicting studies on the efficacy of interferon never stopped doctors, authors and pharmaceutical companies from implying or even overtly stating that they slowed the disease.

A more accurate line could have been Dr. Jelenik's note on a previous study linking sterols and MS: " It adds to the likelihood of the statins being useful for MS, and also underscores the likely role of fats in the disease"

[SNOOPY]

What would have happened if you religiously followed the Swank diet ?

Since my high cholesterol had nothing to do with diet my assumption would be nothing would have changed had I been on the Swank diet.

Again...my high cholesterol was caused by a medication. Had I have been taken off that medication and my cholesterol rechecked at a later date a I would not have had high cholesterol and hence, not on a statin.

[ffjosh]

I do the opposite...I eat all the meat and milk I want.

However I do exercise.

[JerryD]

So you 'exercise' the fats and casein out of your cells. ' Better to be 'excised'. ffjosh, your comment 'slays me'. What you put in, is what you will get out. Reap what you sow. Good luck