Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

How does RRMS work?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #31
    Pshrink, I don't dispute that "labeling" per se can have an adverse influence, or be a lazy convenience, or be a human foible.

    Medically, I think it is important to identify a specific diagnosis (or apply a "label" if you prefer) for purposes of planning effective treatment, and for many patients, to set the mind at ease after years of being told "there is nothing wrong with you."

    As defined in medical journals, the term "benign MS" means a patient has had MS for 15 or more years and has a Kurtz EDSS less than 2. My neurologist says I have "benign RRMS," but he is not saying that I do not have MS, that I do not have RRMS, that I do not need treatment, or that I will not develop SPMS. Just that I've had MS a long time but my disability score is low.

    As far as insurance, it is the "RRMS" diagnosis that merits the DMT coverage. I do not think there is even an ICD-9 code for "benign" MS. I spent 12 years as a health insurance executive, but quit that job 6 years ago, so this may have changed.

    As I understand it, the "medical profession" as a whole has not decided that the term "benign MS" is needed; it remains controversial, since even those who believe in "benign MS" acknowledge the nature of the disease can change tomorrow.

    As Marco pointed out, there may be two distinct phases of MS - an early inflammatory phase, followed by less inflammation and more decay and nerve damage. Some MS patients may pass through the inflammatory phase and then "burn out" or stabilize, no further progression. Right now that description applies to me, and may be why I am labeled "benign."

    "Manic-depressive" vs "Bi-polar disorder" is (in my cynical opinion) a function of the availability of expensive and profitable drugs that are FDA approved for treatment of "bi-polar disorder." Lithium is generic, relatively inexpensive, and was used for years for "manic-depressive disorder." I don't think either term is warm and fuzzy, but that's just me.

    My technical German is limited, but German does sometimes create a new word by compressing several older words into one word to convey a new meaning, much more than seen in English. Bottom line though I don't know for sure, I suspect this "labeling" is not strictly a matter of comparative linguistics.

    Another bottom line, to answer the OP's question - nobody really knows how RRMS, or any other form of this disease works. Yet. I hope we get there, soon.

    Comment


      #32
      Originally posted by onlyairfare View Post
      Unless the doctor also has MS, he or she is not deriving any benefit from treatment with DMT's.
      Don't they get honorariums for major meds scripted?

      Comment


        #33
        If that is so, it certainly doesn't benefit a doctor to diagnose someone with PPMS which I think was one of issues here with diagnosing someone into one of the four MS types.

        There is NO advantage I can see to giving someone a PPMS diagnosis.

        Comment


          #34
          So it would seem to be an advantage to keep people in that cohort, and may also explain why a nurse would find Avonex in a bag of a nursing home patient. (I'm not anti-med obviously, just very cynical. Esp. after reading cafe pharma's message boards with drug reps gloating over the car they just scored.)

          Comment


            #35
            Originally posted by dyin_myelin View Post
            So it would seem to be an advantage to keep people in that cohort, and may also explain why a nurse would find Avonex in a bag of a nursing home patient. (I'm not anti-med obviously, just very cynical. Esp. after reading cafe pharma's message boards with drug reps gloating over the car they just scored.)
            Just guessing that if these aforementioned labels exist, RRMS is highly over-reported! I don't know if that helps patients stay on meds that might help, or hurt MS research as a whole?
            Tawanda
            ___________________________________________
            Diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis 2004; First sign of trouble: 1994

            Comment


              #36
              thank you

              To those who responded to my comment, thank you. Marco, MrsBones and I think Tawanda too. I'm not sure it helped me be any closer to guessing what type of MS I have but that's ok.

              MrsBones, I would like to hear how MS has been for you if you don't mind? I'll send you a private message. If anyone else is interested in hearing my woes and maybe seeing if you can help or offer advice, send me a private message. I was going to put it all here but I really don't want to sound like I'm complaining and I don't want to scare anyone either!!

              I have enjoyed this whole thread a lot - lots of good info here.

              Not officially diagnosed due to non-MS-specific spots on MRIs, but the neurologists all agree it's MS.
              Frustrated. January 2019: finally saw an MS specialist worth seeing. Maybe we'll get to the bottom of this.
              EDSS of 5.5, sometimes 6.0

              Comment


                #37
                no private message ability?

                Well, maybe we are not able to send private messages on this forum? I never thought to try before until now and it seems it's not an option oops.

                I guess it will have to be public, so here goes ... and really, I'm not complaining!

                For me, there is not a day that goes by that MS is not there. If you knew me before this all happened you would have known a super healthy person. Fit, trim, active, full of energy, strong, etc. That was me. Three years in to this MS adventure and [a small example] I struggle to walk up five stairs. I am a small fraction of the person I used to be. I just scratch my head in amazement when I hear of others with MS still working, still hiking, still keeping up with their house work, caring for children, or whatever it is they are still doing.

                Yes, there are many days where I can get a lot of things done, but NOTHING like I used to be and always with a struggle. 'A lot' three years ago was about 5+ times more than 'a lot' today. I am in slow motion, holding on to things so I don't fall over, taking breaks, having others lift things for me, having others drive for me, sometimes using a cane or just staying home so I don't have to go out with one ... it's like I'm 85 years old instead of 37. It used to seem to me that the elderly people did not do much, but now i know they DO! Just like me, they probably do all they can do in one day.

                As for my symptoms, there are days or periods when they are worse and then once in a while there is a day or maybe a few where they seem to be a lot better. Now, once again, the word 'a lot' is relative. They are always there, just every once in a while they are more tolerable and I am 'more' functional. Is this 'remission'?

                'Relapses' - I had one very difficult relapse last year that hit me hard (new symptom: right side weakness and stiffness in foot, leg, hand, arm and face). I have never fully recovered (maybe half way?? sometimes a little better, sometimes a little worse.).

                There is certainly progression. It just seems like soon there will be nothing of me left! As the months have gone by my abilities have been less and less. My responsibilities used to be so great and numerous ... and I was good at them all and I enjoyed them. They have slowly and steadily been given to others and now I'm doing all I can to take care of myself. Even taking a shower is a big chore and I often go without just to save energy and avoid the stress of it all. Once a week or less is about all I can handle. A 'sponge bath' suits me well. I've even had thoughts of cutting off my hair so I don't have to wash it any more I wear a headcovering anyway, so no one would really know or see. It's just that it's THAT difficult to wash my hair and care for it daily (brushing, putting up, taking down, etc.).

                Thanks for listening. Any tips? Advice? Does this sound like someone 3 years in to 'typical' RRMS? Just gearing up for my neurology appointment in two weeks, getting ideas on what to share and ask. I hope this conversation is of some help to the original poster!!!!

                Not officially diagnosed due to non-MS-specific spots on MRIs, but the neurologists all agree it's MS.
                Frustrated. January 2019: finally saw an MS specialist worth seeing. Maybe we'll get to the bottom of this.
                EDSS of 5.5, sometimes 6.0

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by jjs View Post
                  I'm not sure it helped me be any closer to guessing what type of MS.
                  PPMS = no relapses, just consistent decline
                  PRMS = steady decline like PPMS, but also relapses without periods of improvement between flares (no remissions)
                  RRMS = if you have relapses and then periods of improvement.
                  SPMS = period after RRMS with fewer relapses than RRMS

                  1. Since you had a flare up you rule out PPMS.
                  2. If you had improvement after your flare up you rule out PRMS.
                  3. That means you are RRMS and may one day become SPMS. Not all RRMS patients become SPMS, but those that do generally take 10-30 years.

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Hi jjs, I am deemed to be RRMS but I always know that I have it. I used to call it surge week, fifteen days into my cycle. I would hammer out 12-13 hours at my job and still go for a long walk and indulge in a novel or a creative pass-time. Now I get a couple days of normal a month, if you define that as no alarm bells going off and feeling a bit sleepy. Except for a very lucky few 20 year olds who coughed out some transient vision impairment, I think everyone with MS feels pretty bad, most of the time. And it sux.

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by dyin_myelin View Post
                      Except for a very lucky few 20 year olds who coughed out some transient vision impairment, I think everyone with MS feels pretty bad, most of the time. And it sux.
                      Sadly, I think you totally nailed it!
                      Tawanda
                      ___________________________________________
                      Diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis 2004; First sign of trouble: 1994

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by dyin_myelin View Post
                        Don't they get honorariums for major meds scripted?

                        Not exactly. There are strict US federal laws limiting what pharmas can "give" doctors (of all specialties, not just neurology). Pharmaceutical companies can pay "reasonable expenses" if they ask physicians to give educational lectures to other docs, or to participate in clinical trials.

                        I think the same federal laws require pharmas to publicly publish the amounts they pay to doctors, though I haven't actually checked this out.

                        Comment


                          #42
                          My first Neuro (who has since moved on) was really good. She told me she doesn't spend a lot of time with the four "labels" because MS is too complex from patient to patient. She does teach them to interns but she doesn't like to hang the labels out with patients.

                          What's important is getting to understand your MS.

                          At the end of the day, you've got MS and there are things you and your Dr. are doing to try and treat it. The key is to find a "right" med and/or lifestyle to fight off progression and its after-effects.

                          As mentioned earlier, the whole point of the MS meds is not to make you feel better. The only thing the MS meds were designed to do was slow the progression, but that one thing is huge. Look at it this way, in an ideal situation - at least we're not getting worse.

                          The rest of it is up to you.

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Originally posted by Bob698 View Post
                            My first Neuro (who has since moved on) was really good. She told me she doesn't spend a lot of time with the four "labels" because MS is too complex from patient to patient. She does teach them to interns but she doesn't like to hang the labels out with patients.

                            What's important is getting to understand your MS.

                            At the end of the day, you've got MS and there are things you and your Dr. are doing to try and treat it. The key is to find a "right" med and/or lifestyle to fight off progression and its after-effects.

                            As mentioned earlier, the whole point of the MS meds is not to make you feel better. The only thing the MS meds were designed to do was slow the progression, but that one thing is huge. Look at it this way, in an ideal situation - at least we're not getting worse.

                            The rest of it is up to you.
                            Good post! Thanks.
                            Tawanda
                            ___________________________________________
                            Diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis 2004; First sign of trouble: 1994

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            X